2024 Social Impact Women to Watch: Mentorship

Atokatha Ashmond Brew: Welcome to this special episode of The Switch. My name is Atokatha Ashmond Brew, Managing Director for Marketing and Strategic Communication for Nonprofit HR. I am so excited about today’s episode, where we will hear from two women named to Nonprofit HR’s 2024 Social Impact Women to Watch list.

Each year during Women’s History Month, Nonprofit HR is proud to recognize women across North America who have made significant contributions to nonprofits, associations, foundations, social enterprises and the communities they serve. This year, our Social Impact Women to Watch series features panel interviews with the 25 finalists named to this year’s list. On today’s episode, you will hear from Bior Guigni and Dr. Casey Bartrem.

They will be interviewed by Marketing and Communication Specialist with Nonprofit HR, Lindsey Otto. And now a little about our guests. With over two decades of leadership experience, Bior embodies visionary leadership and strategic excellence by demonstrating an unwavering commitment to team building, diversity, equity and inclusion, and advocating for underserved populations.

Bior’s passion for fostering cultural changes is evident in her hands-on approach, leading by example and nurturing individual growth within her team. Her empathetic and compassionate leadership style ensures that the human element is at the forefront of every decision. And a little about Dr. Casey Bartrem.

Dr. Casey Bartrem is an environmental scientist and TIFO’s executive director. Dr. Bartrem has a bachelor’s degree in environmental biology and zoology from Michigan State University and a PhD in environmental science in the University of Idaho. Dr. Bartrem has worked on human health risk assessment in mining recycling communities in Kyrgyzstan, Bangladesh, Nigeria and the United States.
She is a visiting lecturer at the American University of Armenian School of Public Health, where she teaches a course on environmental health risk assessment for the master of public health program. You’re going to enjoy this episode and I hope you share it in your communities. You can find the recording at nonprofithr.com/theswitch.

Without further ado, let’s dive into the conversation with Bior, Dr. Bartrem and Lindsey Otto.

Lindsey Otto: Hello and thank you so much for joining me today. I am so excited to have this chat with you both, two finalists from Nonprofit HR’s 2024 Social Impact Women to Watch list. We are blown away by the work that you’re both currently doing in your organizations.

I’m so honored to have you both here and to chat with you. I would love it first if each of you could just briefly introduce yourselves to our audience and share how it feels to be named Women to Watch.

Bior Guigni: My name is Bior Guigni and I am the CEO of Beat the Streets New England. We are a youth development organization. We utilize sports as that motivator and way to engage with the young people and we serve kids all over the US.

It was for me just a complete honor to be noted as one of the Women to Watch. When I saw the list of the other incredible women, I was also blown away by the work that’s being done nationwide and just completely humbled to be included in that list. And if anything, just really excited to continue to connect, work more closely in some way, shape or form with the other incredible women that are listed on here and beyond.

Casey Bartrem: My name is Casey Bartrem. I’m the Executive Director of TIFO, which stands for TerraGraphics International Foundation, a nonprofit that essentially prevents pollution from poisoning people. We support governments all over the world, as well as nonprofits and researchers and community groups to determine how pollution makes people sick and then find interventions to keep that from happening.

I’m really thrilled and honored, like Bior said, to be among such an incredible group of women. I think we’re at a time when women aren’t just lifting or even shattering the glass ceiling, but also looking around them to see how they can bring others beyond that barrier. When I look at this list of finalists, I’m really humbled and inspired by all the work folks are doing and want to congratulate everybody, Bior included, for being named on the Women to Watch list.

Lindsey Otto: Thank you both so much for that. Congratulations again. I’m so interested to know what drew you both to your organization’s mission and to the social impact space in general.

So whoever wants to jump on that first, please feel free.

Bior Guigni: I was drawn to the organization’s mission because it resonated with who I am as a person and how I grew up. I wrestled starting in high school and I was the only girl in an all boys team and then wrestled on one of the first women’s program nationwide. And then from there, continued to pursue opportunities that were considered a first.

Very little opportunities for women in sport and wrestling. We didn’t have women’s wrestling Olympics until 2004. So for me, wrestling was always a competitive sport.

It was something that I associated with a lot of sacrifice and commitment. And it wasn’t until I actually went to one of the first events that Beat the Street was hosting that I saw wrestling as fun and a way that young people were engaging with the sport. And it just dawned on me that a lot of who I am today and a lot of what I’ve learned in the sense of dealing with difficult situations or leadership was from that sport.

So it became a mission to get involved and really help kids understand the incredible lessons that we were learning in real time and how to utilize them sooner than later. That was something that I just found really incredible. It became a way to take what ended up as a negative and turning it into a positive and a way to give back through it.

Casey Bartrem: That’s incredible. What drew me to TIFO’s mission and the social impact space in one word would be justice.

We believe that everybody has this right to live and to work in a healthy environment.

It’s a pretty simple thing. And I think we often are presented with this false binary choice of you can have economic vitality or a good healthy environment, but you have to choose between those two things. And I think TIFO rejects that narrative outright.

And we’ve seen that both are possible and achieve that in some parts of the world, but unfortunately in a lot of places, we’ve achieved that because it’s being subsidized by communities that bear a disproportionate burden of disease and pollution. And I think most people when they are faced with that, they want to be a part of that solution. And for me, I’ve found a way to do that through TIFO.

The other thing that has kept me at TIFO is the approach that we’re not trying to come in with the savior complex into communities and say, we’re here to help, we’re gonna fix all of these problems. Rather than being this paternalistic savior organization, we really try to respectfully enter that place and see where there’s local knowledge that we can help support. I’m a nerdy scientist, so how can we use the science that I know to support the priorities in those communities and make it better for folks?

And so I really appreciate both justice-centered mission, as well as the way that the organization goes about trying to realize that.

Lindsey Otto: What I’m hearing from both of you is you’re both trailblazing of sorts in your own respective paths. I really, really admire that. I would love to know, as you’ve come to be leaders in your organization, what’s sort of your philosophy around people management and how do you take that mission and what else do you take to engage that mission-driven talent that you’re now leading?

Casey Bartrem: I’ll jump in, Bior, if that’s all right.

Bior Guigni: Yeah, absolutely.

Casey Bartrem: One of the wonderful things about working for an organization that has, we’re a very small organization, we have this really outsized impact, is that inherently you just attract people who want to be a part of a solution, who are passionate and driven and willing to be introspective and grow as individuals, professionals. So I can’t take much credit, I think, for attracting talent, but I do think that there is a responsibility that comes with that. That’s an important piece of leadership that I often come back to, is that we have this small and mighty team of people working together that I have a responsibility to.

And so I want to support people’s growth, make sure that the job is fulfilling, but they also have a healthy work-life balance, which in the nonprofit sector, I’m sure everybody is gonna tell you, is always a challenge that we’re trying to deal with, as well as carve out time to make sure that their input is included in how we carry out programs, because there’s just so much great energy and ideas that come from the people who work for these organizations. There’s a old and maybe a little bit overplayed African proverb that I still think it’s really important and really relevant to this question in particular, and it’s that if you wanna go fast, you go alone, and if you wanna go far, you go together. And I’m sure many folks have heard that, but I don’t think I ever had a time in my life where I dreamed of being a manager.

I don’t know, I didn’t grow up thinking, yeah, I wanna manage people. That wasn’t the dream. I think the women that are nominated for this recognition do things like inspire and encourage and listen and support.

That’s, for me, how you ensure that people continue to work towards collective goals, because that’s what people have done for me, right? And that’s what’s kept me on board. And so then I just wanna pay that forward.

You hit a lot of the things that I think I would have repeated as well. And it’s incredible to hear just the way that you view that leadership, because I think that’s really important in how we take on our role and how we choose to lead our organizations really impacts the amazing people that we have working for us and how they show up and also how they go home. And that’s really important too.

I remember when I was younger, I thought if you worked long hours and you worked really hard and you worked seven days a week, you’re gonna advance faster than you ever could. And you have these big dreams of what it means to be successful. And then you transition into mission driven work and then you double down on that because you care so much about the work that you’re doing.

It doesn’t feel like you’re sacrificing your time and your energy and even relationships. It just feels like you’re giving because at the end of the day, you know that what you’re doing is gonna be something that you can be proud of. And so I just looked at my role and I said, well, it’s my responsibility to protect that time and to protect that energy and to provide opportunities, almost mandate opportunities to make sure that our team was spending time at home, time with their families, time doing things that they love and then providing mentorship opportunities outside of just our organization so that they can have a go-to person that they didn’t feel would be an internal person so they can be more honest and open and willing with the information or time and energy and resources that they need to continue to do well.

And so that’s where I spend most of my time is just making sure that my team has the resources that they need, that they have someone to talk to and that they’re taking that time. And it starts with setting the tone. We do not have meetings before 10 a.m. Sometimes partners will request them and I’ll honor it with partners, but internally, there’s no pre-10 a.m. meetings.

And we try to take off as many additional days as possible around the holidays if we can, because I never want someone to have to ask for time with their family. I want them to have that time with their family.

That’s super interesting. That’s a great philosophy, I think, to take forward.

Lindsey Otto: Yeah, absolutely. I think that segues very well into sort of what we want to talk about today, and that’s mentorship. I hear this through line of encourage and support as leaders of your team.

And I would love if each of you could share a memorable experience of mentorship, either as the mentor or as the mentee that has significantly impacted your personal or professional development as a leader.

Bior Guigni: That was a tough one for me when I was thinking about it, because for me in sports, you always think of yourself as a coach. And so as a coach, you feel like you have a responsibility to get your team to perform their best. And so when I started my leadership journey, I considered myself a coach for my team.
And it wasn’t until someone said, oh, you’ve been such a great mentor, that I was like, me? A mentor? Like, get out of here.

Like, I never even thought of that. And I realized if you’re coaching right, you are essentially mentoring someone or you are a mentor coach. And that actually changed the entire way we viewed what we do as an organization and how we lead, is that we start taking the word coach away and putting in the word mentor because that really is what we’re doing.

And I think there’s a sense of responsibility or different sense of responsibility that comes with mentoring versus coaching. And so we’re like, all right, we’re mentor coaching. And that changes how we view the kids that we’re working with, the people that we’re impacting and connecting with, and also like our roles within the community.

I always say that I became an accidental mentor just because I was doing my job. You really cared about the work that I was doing. So the first time you hear that someone calls you a mentor, I think it’s the most impactful.

And then from then, I always wanted to make sure that if I was engaging with someone or if our team was engaging with anyone, we took it on with kind of that lens and that sense of responsibility that a mentor would have.

Casey Bartrem: You mentioned that difference between the coach and a mentor. If you had to say what the difference is between those two things, how do you distinguish those two?

Bior Guigni: That’s a great question. I think as a coach, you go in and you have a specific plan of what you want for your team or the individual. And then you’re kind of working with them to pursue that plan and have goals along the way.

As a mentor, I realized that we were coming in and we were building the plan based on that person’s needs and having them figure out what goals they are. And it was my job to kind of help them navigate the pathways to achieve those goals. And in reality, those could be one and the same, but it just kind of took looking at it from a different lens to realize, you technically are doing both at the same time, but really what matters is if someone’s coming to you with a need or a request, instead of saying, how can I use my list of things to help you with, how can we use a list of things that you have plus my resources to help you?

Casey Bartrem: That’s awesome, thank you. Sorry to put you on the spot.

Bior Guigni: Well, that’s great, I love the question.

Casey Bartrem: I struggled preparing this question too, but for really different reasons, and it’s because I’ve been really fortunate in my life to have really strong, remarkably supportive individuals who are mentors. And so I was trying to think of one memorable experience, what is the thing that I wanna say in this discussion? And I think I landed on this, that I have a board of directors that’s awesome.
I’m humbled by each of them, right? That I get to work with them. And they all invest this immense energy into supporting students and young professionals, both within TIFO, but also just in their daily lives, in their work.

And a few years ago, two of them had to step away from their roles with TIFO just temporarily, but very unexpectedly. And they did a lot of active daily work with TIFO. So I’d worked really closely with them for 12 years.

And then all of a sudden, like literally overnight, it was in a free fall, really, trying to figure out how to manage this organization without their support. And it was a little bit shocking because I couldn’t just shoot them that email to ask for advice. Reflecting back now, a couple years later on what happened, I think what I realized is that they set me up for success all along the way, right?

Never thinking that that was how it was gonna go down. And I was able to navigate it. I made mistakes, I screwed up, it wasn’t pretty, but you know, we figure it out, right?

And so I don’t think I would have been able to do that without those years of mentoring. I’m pretty sure I wouldn’t have been able to do that. And I remember in that moment, in that time period, when I was in a difficult situation, I would just stop and I’d think, okay, if I called Margaret right now, what would she say?

Or if I shot Ian an email right now, what questions would he shoot back to me before he wanted to give me advice? Like he would always ask more and more questions, right, before he’d give an answer. And so I think I was able to do that because they were such strong figures.

And I have a lot of people in my life like that. So they set me up for success, and then eventually they stepped back and I had to figure things out on my own and both of those things were really important. I grew a lot from both of those.

And that’s so hard. Finally, trusting in yourself to make those mistakes and continue to move forward and then realizing, oh, that’s exactly what they set you up for is like that thinking and that being able to kind of problem solve and troubleshoot. And it becomes so easy to lean on someone, but then having to step away, that’s amazing.

Bior Guigni: And being able to admit like you’ve made those mistakes along the way, I think is huge as well.

Casey Bartrem: Thank you. And to be fair, I have a ridiculous fear of making mistakes and it probably has held me back way too much in life, but getting better.

Lindsey Otto: I echo everything Bior just said. That also comes from nurturing that relationship. You were able to kind of think about, okay, well, what would this person say?

Because I really value what they have to say and what they’ve taught me, right? And I think that just speaks to the trust that’s there, both in what you were sharing, Casey, and I’m sure, Bior, in the coach-mentor relationship with the people that you’re serving as well. You wanna cultivate that trust.

I wanna talk uniquely about women mentorship. What do you think are some of the unique challenges and opportunities that women face in finding and cultivating those mentor relationships?

Bior Guigni: I think a lot of times the challenges, and I can only speak for my personal experience, but the challenges that I faced was that everyone that I had to look up to for a long time was male. And so trying to find a mentor, someone that I felt really comfortable going to that maybe was having the same experiences as me wasn’t readily available. I mean, I am an immigrant.

I am a person of color. I am a woman in a male-dominated sport that is 98% male. And even, I think 75% of that is white male.

And so I had to kind of decide, all right, who was gonna be the female friendliest or who was the supporter of women in sports, who was someone that I think could help me navigate this minefield of potential setbacks, you know, trying to become a female leader. And that was really challenging. And so for me, I think that I had to find a community of people because everyone was gonna provide something very different and then really understand, to Casey’s point, what this person brings to the table for me and what this person brings to the table for me and how this person has me questioning things a little differently.

And in my mind, I always thought that I was gonna be able to find this one mentor, which typically would have been a coach, but it really took a community of people to find that specific need because there wasn’t someone that I saw very similar to me in that position at that time.

I’m really grateful that you shared that perspective because I think the thing that popped into my mind with this question was finding someone you identify with. And identity means a lot of different things, but for me, I’m a straight white woman and I grew up in the middle of a cornfield, so I can identify and relate to most people that I see in the nonprofit field where I particularly work. But I recognize that that’s not the case for a lot of folks and so thank you for sharing that perspective.

So I think it’s probably the most important one. I think the only thing that I would add the opportunity there is that there’s an increasing effort right now for women to support each other that I see happening. So even though there are fields where women and especially women of color have been historically underrepresented, slowly that’s changing.

We all like to see it changing faster, but I think just from my perspective, I’ve seen some changes. And so even though there’s a lot of ground to cover, there’s an opportunity now, I think, to be hopeful and inspired because we have more women getting into those positions and also recognizing that they wanna help other women come through. And so I have hope for what’s to come.

Lindsey Otto: I certainly do as well, especially with this campaign and having conversations with you all and all of the finalists on our list. It gives me so much hope as a woman to hear the things that you’re doing. And I would love to continue on this path that we’re on.

Bior, I would love to hear your thoughts, especially on this in terms of male-dominated fields and industries. How can mentorship be leveraged to address these gender disparities, promote gender equality in leadership positions and sort of help women to navigate the complexities of mentorship?

Bior Guigni: I don’t have as much of an answer because I do a story that could possibly be a learning opportunity for someone else. We were awarded like an innovative award for the work that we’re doing with wrestling-based youth development. And part of that, there were states that were gonna give you an executive coach.

And the executive coach is gonna be your mentor and this is the someone that you’re gonna be working with for a year. And like, that’s incredible. I’m so excited about this.

And then they asked me, who would you like or what do you think you would need from your executive coach? And immediately my mind went to, I work with all men, therefore I want a male coach. And I want a male coach who has been an executive, who maybe understands or loves sports and is someone who is gonna be able to like, help me talk shop with the rest of the male executives or the people in my community that are wrestling based.

And when I ended up getting as my mentor coach or my executive coach was the complete opposite. They paired me with a woman, they paired me with a woman whose family had owned a toy store, which is really great, and who was in charge of her family’s foundation. And I had to really take a step back and check myself because I was like, for a moment disappointed that I didn’t get the male mentor that I thought I needed, but I got a woman who had a very different background.

And when I could tell you this woman changed my life, like I could barely say it without getting teary. This person has been an advocate, had me sitting there and asking myself really hard questions. Like, why did I want a male mentor?
What was I trying to do? Was I trying to just lead that way and kind of conform to what I thought leadership in our industry, our organizations look like? Or was I trying to find my path and my way as a leader and really use my voice, like I mentioned before, be someone that young people can see leading in the way they want to lead, or be someone that they hadn’t seen before, and I had been given this incredible opportunity and didn’t even think of that, even though years before, I was looking for the exact same thing.

And so I had to really take a step back and be like, wow, sometimes we get in our own way, and sometimes we don’t even give other women opportunities to be that example for us, or to be our mentors or our go-to, unless it’s in our friendship circle. So we’re still friends. I go to her for advice constantly.

I love meeting with her for lunch. She helped me go from being a director, and I thought I was always gonna be like, I make a great number or two. I’m gonna be a COO.

I’m gonna support somebody else. And to be like, no, I am an executive director. I am gonna be a CEO.

These are what I bring to the table. This is the power within me. And I don’t think I ever would have done that if I had stuck to my guns and been like, no, I want a male mentor, because this is what I see in my field versus having someone who really helped me understand who I was and bring out the best in myself.
And that took another woman, because only another woman is going to know what you go through as a woman.

Lindsey Otto: Absolutely. Thank you so much for sharing that. That’s such a great story for you to reflect on in terms of like your growth and everything like that.

And I think it speaks to sort of, you know, how you want to move moving forward. It’s a male-dominated industry, it seems, is that what the future is looking like, creating that change, I think starts with sort of thinking differently.
I would love to know next from you, Casey, what are the essential qualities to look for in a mentor? I know you mentioned earlier, you know, find someone you can connect with, you can identify with. How can women identify potential mentors who align with their goals and values?

Casey Bartrem: I think there’s a lot of self-reflection in finding a mentor. And I think Bior really just touched on that because she talked about how she had to do a self-check when she found out who the mentor was that she got paired with, right? And so I think there is that need for self-reflection when you’re thinking through this.

You have to be aware of what your needs are and what your shortfalls are, like where you need to work on yourself as a professional and as a human. And I think everyone’s needs there are gonna be different. For me, I needed someone who challenges me and pushes me because I do have that fear of making mistakes, right?

I don’t wanna do something wrong. My mentors have really challenged me and put me in situations where I had to lead or feel a little uncomfortable. And they didn’t do that without helping me prepare for those things, but they also didn’t let me back out.

I have this terrible, almost debilitating fear of public speaking, like even right now, my heart is racing and I’m a little bit nervous. Anytime I have to do a presentation, speak to a class, which happens often, that’s what happens to me. And so my mentors, really what they did is they kept putting me in situations where I had this opportunity to talk about research and projects that I’m really passionate about.

And they kept asking me to do it. And they would practice something before each presentation and give me feedback after, good and bad, you know, one was good cop, one was bad cop, and it was really good for me. And I think that pushing is what I needed, right?

I needed someone who kind of challenged me and told me, no, you need to, you need to do this, you can do it. You know, don’t just play it safe. I think what I’ve been reflecting on a little bit more recently is that there’s a certain amount of struggle you have to go through to grow.

And I touched on that earlier. And I think that’s a theme that, you know, we’re coming out of this conversation with. I’m not talking about trauma or suffering, but I think resilience does come from having to figure things out and from having to struggle a certain amount.

So getting over those fears, like fear of making mistake, fear of public speaking, whatever it is, that sink or swim, that’s when I’ve grown the most as an individual. And so I think that finding mentors that help you navigate that is super important.

Lindsey Otto: Sort of empower you to trust yourself. Growth is uncomfortable, but they push you to be uncomfortable and put yourself sort of in that situation. I can wholeheartedly relate to that.

Being pushed into situations where I’m like, I’m not sure if I’m ready for this, but my boss or whoever it is like, no, you’re ready. Like you just have to trust yourself. Like you can do it.

And then you’re uncomfortable and then you get through it and you’re like, wow, that was really great. I learned so much, you know, whether it went well or it didn’t.

Bior, do you have anything to add to that question?

Bior Guigni: Oh, I thought that was great. And I think the only thing I would add is how to learn to be very honest with myself. And so my internal dialogue had changed significantly because, you know, with those questions, the clarifying questions and things like that, it’s like, here’s what I wish could happen or want to happen, and here’s realistically what is gonna happen and how I’m gonna achieve that.

I had to have some really honest conversations with myself, and that was probably the biggest growth that I ever had was, again, with checking myself, being honest with myself, and then continuing to pursue other opportunities to grow through mentoring.

Lindsey Otto: Yeah, and so what strategies or approaches would you all recommend for women wanting to prioritize being a mentor or being a role model for others?

Bior Guigni: The main thing for me was make the time. It doesn’t matter how busy or crazy things get. Being a mentor or having a mentor is self care at the end of the day as well.

And I think often that’s something that we tend to neglect, especially as female leaders. And so because I had to make the time, it was mandatory as part of this program, I’ve learned to continue to make the time and then to value other people making that time as well. And also welcome whoever those mentors may be, which was another learning thing for me that you never know what a great mentor could look like or be like.

It’s just if you’re valuing that relationship and you’re continuously growing and they’re asking you challenging questions and they’re being an advocate and a cheerleader, that that’s a mentor and continue to cultivate that relationship and make time for that relationship. There’s also ways that you can pursue professional mentoring relationships as well. And I highly encourage that.

Everyone on my team has an executive coach now too, because it was such a valuable tool for me and I wanted them to be able to have that opportunity as well. Organizations or schools where this is actually part of their curriculum where they need to do that mentoring. So if you’re looking to just try it, not that I’m trying to pitch for it, but if you’re looking to try it out, there is ways that you can do it at very low risk for you, if you’re just looking to learn.

But I’m so glad I did. And it is something that I will always continue to make time for. And those relationships start to feel so much like friendships and then they do grow into friendships.

You can’t put a value on that.

Lindsey Otto: I have a quick follow up question to that. Bior, you said being a mentor is self care. Could you kind of explain a little more your thinking around that?

Bior Guigni: For those of us who work in nonprofit, it’s because we feel good doing good. And a lot of it’s because we want to give back, we want to see positive change, and we’re taking on really challenging situations in our communities. And so when you have that like little win of the day, or you know that you’ve done something good, or you’ve gotten something across the finish line, for those of us who work in this industry, it’s like that’s your little boost of like adrenaline and joy for the day.

And I think when you’re having those conversations and really mentoring someone and there’s that co-appreciation for each other, that it’s just such a feel-good moment and those conversations, you’ll learn a lot about yourself, you learn a lot about the other person. And as you continue to build those relationships, they become very deep and very rewarding.

Lindsey Otto: We have one final question I would love to ask of both of you. Can you share any advice or insights for women who may feel hesitant or unsure about seeking mentorship opportunities or other forms of support informally, but they aspire to advance their careers and pursue their passions with that kind of support?

Casey Bartrem: I’ll jump in first. I think you’ve just done a great job speaking to the formal relationships. And I’ve never gone into one of those professional development kind of situations.

I have a lot of great folks in my organization that do that. But I also, I think that there’s this other form of mentorship that’s way more informal. And for me, it’s been over the years, there’s people that, I go grab a cup of coffee or I go for a walk with every few months and just catch up with them.

And there are people that I really respect that work maybe in the same similar field, but maybe on very different fields. And so I would, I think there’s two things that I would encourage folks to do. And I’d be interested to hear both of your thoughts on other things as well.

But for me, I would find someone you respect and just ask them if they benefited from a mentor. And it might not be that they use that word, right? It might be somebody that just gave them advice when they needed it or help them along their professional path.

But kind of finding out what that looked like for that person that you respect and look up to. I think the other thing is that if it’s, I think it’s a little intimidating sometimes to think about going out and engaging in that kind of, finding that kind of relationship maybe. I have a list of people in my desk that I keep on a note that I want to reach out to for questions or advice from time to time.

And I think that if people generate that kind of list, they can call somebody up, ask them to commute for a cup of coffee. Or if it’s not somebody who lives near you, you know, a phone call or a Zoom or whatever, that looks like. I think the most awkward part is that initial reach out.

It’s kind of like making a new friend, right? You have to give it a little bit of uncertainty and then it becomes this really valuable, worthwhile endeavor once you’re over that hurdle.

I love that idea of pumping the list.

That’s a great idea. You know, I think sometimes you can think of like one or two people in your head, but to have that list of resources is really great. And the walk in the coffee, you know, I think anything you do to alleviate pressure from that interaction and put it in your own comfort zone.

For a long time, I thought of meeting people as like dating or quick dates that I had joined this like professional network and they’re like, you’re going to be going on dates. And I was like, no, I am awful at this. I am terrified of that.
Are you kidding me? I put as reasons why I’m single. That as like meeting someone is kind of thinking every day.

I’m like, what dates have you been on? These sound great, but a coffee date or a walking date or just something that you can connect with someone or find a common bond with and then build off of that. That’s amazing.
And I would say the only other thing that I can think of is don’t be afraid to reach out. I think a lot of people are honored or even excited to hear from you when it comes to asking those questions or asking for advice and hopefully open and willing to having those relationships. But like Casey said, it could just be as simple as someone that you consider a friend and just wanna ask questions to or it can be as formal as where I’ve been with executive coaching, but it’s just being open to that feedback and being honest with yourself as well.

So you have to be in a good place to be mentored as well as pursuing a mentor.

Yeah, that’s a very good point.

Yeah, that’s a great point. And I think it speaks a little bit to that thing where as mentors, we learn as much as we’re delivering advice and support, right? So it’s not that it’s a one-directional thing, so people shouldn’t be afraid of it.
Especially the young women that I’ve worked with, I’ve learned so much from them. I don’t know, it’s helped me grow as a human and as a professional. So you’re not only putting someone out by asking them to help you out with advice because they’re gonna learn something too.

Yeah, I think as women, we have a tendency to kind of shy away from those things in terms of what value am I adding to this relationship. But I think it’s so great to hear from you both in terms of how being a mentor, I have not been a mentor myself, but how being a mentor is so beneficial for you as well. So thank you for everything you’ve shared today.
Just to wrap up our conversation, if the audience hears nothing else from this conversation, what final words would you like to leave with them to glean from our discussion today? Any words of wisdom, words of advice, insights?

I think the initial part is the hardest, reaching out and establishing those relationships. For me, it’s like Bior said, it’s like dating. It’s that first date that’s the most awkward, right?

And so the more you can do to put it in your comfort zone or just call and ask them for advice, right? It doesn’t have to be calling them and saying, I want you to be my mentor. Just think of somebody that you think would be able to help you solve a problem and reach out and ask them about that and then let it grow a little bit organically from there.

Yeah, and to add to the date, be yourself when you’re on it. I think oftentimes, even if you’re asking a friend a difficult question that you maybe haven’t asked before or you’re meeting someone for the first time, I think we put these guards up to protect ourselves just in case it doesn’t go how we planned. But be open, be vulnerable, be yourself, and then hopefully that’ll cultivate into a really great relationship.

And you just never know who a mentor could be to you or who you might be a mentor to as well. Absolutely.

Casey Bartrem and Bior Guigni, 2024 Social Impact Women to Watch finalists. I am so excited that you’ve been here and you’ve been sharing your story. Thank you both.

Casey Bartrem: This has been so much fun.

Thank you so much.

Atokatha Ashmond Brew: Well, that’s our share for today. I hope you enjoyed listening to the conversation as much as I did. Very special thank you to Bior and Dr. Bartrem and also Lindsey Otto for having such a spirited conversation.

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